Thursday, February 19, 2009

Lalaji and Sahaj marg.

By looking at the absurd statements made by Parthasarthi Rajagopalachari regarding lalaji and his group, we decided to investigate this claim of Shree RamChandra Mission run by Chari & company, we were astonished when we came to know that Parthasarthi Rajagopalachari lie's about Lalaji and makes up stories about RamChandra of fathegarh alias lalaji, which were in absolute contradiction to the character of lalaji, we discussed and referred to some more groups and organizations which were established by lalali himself and we finally came to conclusion that parthasarthi rajagopalchari has made up all the stories about lalaji and used those stories to manipulate and fool people all in name of spirituality.

This post contains discussion our from orkut community freedom from SRCM-Sahaj Marg Discussion can be found under topic Lalaji

After our investigation and discussion, we came to this conclusion that lalaji was never associated with Sahaj marg, he had his own method, which is taken care of by santmat of fathegarh, and another organization in mathura, Chari's claim that lalaji is a master in the linage of sahaj marg is a bogus claim, exactly similar to their claim that sahaj marg is modified version of raja yoga.

Here is the statement from Chari which instigated us to get to the roots of Lalaji's association with Chari's Sahaj marg.

Lalaji Maharaj, whose birth anniversary we are celebrating today has ordained–it was not merely an expression of his wishes–has ordained that abhyasis should marry amongst each other, so that in two or three generations we have an exploding Sahaj Marg population.

Go through the discussion and feel free to add your comments.

Orkut Discussion:-


SRCM claims that lalaji is the founder of the system of sahaj marg, not only this, our funny joker P. Rajagopalachari also claims that lalaji has ordered that members of his cult must marry each other.

If we try to find out the roots of the problem we are facing today (i.e sahaj marg), we may end-up finding various version of lalaji and his theory of transmission, Chari's gang claims that Lalaji re-discovered Raja Yoga, here is what they claim in their website:-

He rediscovered and refined the ancient raja yoga method of pranahuti, whereby divine energy is transmitted by the Master into the heart of the aspirant in order to expedite his or her spiritual development

Now there is something also called as Raja Yoga system of "Pranahuti", this is not patanjali's Raja Yoga but raja yoga of "Pranahuti" and it is ancient as well, the same group also claims that same system is modified version of Patanjali's Raja Yoga wherein they start from the last stage of patanjali's raja yoga, these hopeless attempt to present sahaj marg as modified version of raja yoga speaks volumes about true nature of this system.

Sahaj Marg has got nothing to do with raja yoga, it is simply a product of hallucination on part of Babuji, and
Chari has simply made it worst.

Lalaji on other hand seems to be a follower of Islam, we have three groups currently which claims exclusive successor-ship from Lalaji, they are:-

1. Ramashram satsang

2. Santmat


There are few more, but they do not claim exclusive ownership of Lalaji, we are aware of Lalaji's family linage, and they are also into this business of selling divinity.

All these group present a different picture of Lalaji and color Lalaji according to their own vision and do not present the true picture. We need to know and understand few things here they are:-

1. What has caused sahaj marg to come into existence!

2. Why and how sahaj marg turned out to be a worst kind of brainwashing cult!

3. Is there anything spiritual in sahaj marg? if yes what?

4. How come Lalaji is involved in something of this nature which is hell bent in destroying the foundations of our society?

5. Why sahaj marg breaks family?

6. Why and how sahaj marg makes its followers week and cowards?

We need to find out answers to these questions and i intend to start a discussion on these 6 topic in our forum, so that all those who are reading our forum may get a glimpse of what is sahaj marg in relaity?

I intend to start with Lalaji, and i will take 3 references for the same, to start with we will analyze the Ramashram satsang version of Lalaji's history, here is their link:-

http: //spiritual-meditation. org/background. htm

They say:-

Rev. Lala ji Maharaj was formally initiated by his Master into the Spiritual Transmission system of Meditation on
23 January 1896 and was finally proclaimed a great saint and spiritual Master on 11 October 1896 in a large convention of saints and advanced devotees. After the demise of his spiritual Master, Rev. La1aji Maharaj took up the mission of spreading the Spiritual Transmission linked Meditation system to the needy aspirants in a big way from 1911 upto Aug.14, 1931 when he merged into supreme consciousness for ever. His most beloved disciple Rev. Dr. Srikrishan LaUi Maharaj was proclaimed as saint vested with full spiritual powers by Rev. Lala ji Maharaj in his life time itself, who continued the mission of his Master from 1931 onwards from his Ramashram located at Sikandarabad (UP.)

Another version of Lalaji is available here:-

http: //astrologerjolly. tripod. com/ramashram. htm

When Mahatma Ji was eighteen, he came in contact with a great Sufi Master, Maulana Fazal Ahmed Khan Saheb. Khan Saheb was totally above the preposterous idea of man-man divide in the name of religion. "Khuda mazhab mein nahin, muhabbat mein hai" (God is not in religions, He is in love) was his fundamental belief. He was a siddha, an enlightened master. His followers included people from all faiths. He found in Mahatma Ji an able soul who could further his mission to awake general masses to devote themselves to the path of God.

Like his master, Mahatma Ji was a great humanitarian. He lived a simple life. Many of his disciples carried his mission of spreading the light of truth. A number of such organisations are today working pronouncing that the wisdom of sages are meant for the common people and boundaries dividing the mankind are only man made.

Thakur Saheb Shri Ram Singh Ji was a Sant in the lineage of Sufism and Santmat in
India. A great generous and reformist Sufi mystic, Maulana Fazal Ahemad Khan Saheb chose to bestow his grace on his able desciple belonging to Hindu faith, Mahatma Shri Ram Chandra Ji Maharaj (Lala Ji). Thakur Saheb was one of the great disciples of Mahatma Shri Ram Chandra Ji Maharaj.

This is another linage of Lalaji.

nd finally the version of Lalaji presented by Chari's gang:-

http: //www. sahajmarg. org/welcome/masters/lalaji. html

His personality, mode of living and general behaviour earned Lalaji the respect and affection of his neighbours. He was much loved by Hindus and Muslims alike, and though he loved his followers with all their faults, he was also a strict disciplinarian. In contrast to the practices of his time, he was very much against rituals and idol worship and in favour of the remarriage of widows as well as the education of women.

Display of any kind was repugnant to Lalaji, and he advised aspirants to stay away from powers until they reached their goal and discipline was perfected. He felt that every aspirant needed a spiritual Master, and that great care should be taken in selecting one. His doors were open to all, and he would frequently transmit to his followers until
2 o’clock in the morning. He regarded morality as essential to
Self-realisation and love as the greatest spiritual practice.

August 14, 1931, Lalaji passed away, leaving Babuji to continue his work for the upliftment of humankind.

From these 3 version of Lalaji, at max only one of these can be true, which in turn means, two of these groups are liars and are fake, manipulating people and fooling them in name of someone who died long back !!!

We need to analyze these 3 groups to start with our quest to find the roots of our problem which is sahaj marg.

I hope we will have some good discussion about this topic and can come to a conclusion.

All the 3 groups in question claim that Lalaji left his most beloved disciple to carry forward his work, first one is

1. His most beloved disciple Rev. Dr. Srikrishan LaUi Maharaj was proclaimed as saint vested with full spiritual powers by Rev. Lala ji Maharaj in his life time itself, who continued the mission of his Master from 1931 onwards from his Ramashram located at Sikandarabad (UP.)
http: //spiritual-meditation. org/background. Htm

2. Maulana Fazal Ahemad Khan Saheb chose to bestow his grace on his able desciple belonging to Hindu faith, Mahatma Shri Ram Chandra Ji Maharaj (Lala Ji). Thakur Saheb was one of the great disciples of Mahatma Shri Ram Chandra Ji Maharaj.
http: //astrologerjolly. tripod. com/ramashram. htm


3. On
August 14, 1931, Lalaji passed away, leaving Babuji to continue his work for the upliftment of humankind.
http: //www. sahajmarg. org/welcome/masters/lalaji. html

They all cannot be true at the same time, only one of these groups is honest and a genuine one, question we need to answer is which one?


You say:

Lalaji on other hand seems to be a follower of Islam, we have three groups currently which claims exclusive successor-ship from Lalaji, they are:-
1. Ramashram satsang
2. Santmat

Of the three groups you mentionned, which group is SANTMAT? What is SANTMAT? The use of Shabda, as in SOUND or a MANTRA? You don't mention SANTMAT in any other group.
You also say: "Lalaji seems to be a follower of Islam". You will note that in the "golden chain" on Lalaji's family site: NaqshMuMRa Nexus, the Prophet Mahummad has been removed by Dr Chandra Gupta, to whom the Sufi Saints and Sufism site of Dr. PK Gupta: and the words: "my master, my GOd" have been inserted.
If you want input from everyone, such as myself, let us keep words of "insult" such as "cowards", or "weak", "liars", "fake", "frauds", "zombies", "brainwashed", "cults", etc... out of this "LOGICAL" discussion (debate). Those are "subjective" and merely Points of View (POV) ...
It does not encourage an "intellectual" debate but lowers the tolerance level to "emotionalism", and all its many veils of many colours. Emotionalism does not reveal the true colour of REALITY and/or TRUTH that would be closer to WHITE LIGHT ... or a LIGHT or thought of very high FREQUENCY... If we can't see the WHITE light in others, then let them colour their own REALITY with their "colours" and we can simply REVEAL or EXPOSE them by "quoting" them, not creating and inventing new words of "PUT-DOWN".
Thanks for understanding ...
Cyril borg...


I am not sure about surat shabd and its association with Santmat, what i am referring to is the concept postulated about santmat by ramashram satsang, here is what they claim:-
Thakur Saheb Shri Ram Singh Ji was a Sant in the lineage of Sufism and Santmat in
India. A great generous and reformist Sufi mystic, Maulana Fazal Ahemad Khan Saheb chose to bestow his grace on his able desciple belonging to Hindu faith, Mahatma Shri Ram Chandra Ji Maharaj (Lala Ji). Thakur Saheb was one of the great disciples of Mahatma Shri Ram Chandra Ji Maharaj.
http://www.jollycreations. com/spiritual. asp
About using the terms which are truth, but difficult to digest, its my responsibility because i am making those statement, and i am ready to take my words back, IF ANYONE CAN PROVE THEM TO BE WRONG!!
Comfort is no test for truth, on the contrary truth is often far from being comfortable..... SV
I will not hesitate to speak the truth, i will speak what i believe is truth, if my view is proven wrong, i will not hesitate to take my words back, and tender an apology, but for this to happen, someone must come forward and prove me wrong..
I will wait for some more time, so that we can get input from some more user's having information about Lalaji, we will wind up this discussion soon.


The simplicity with which Lalaji and Babuji propagated this system of pranahuthi aided Raja yoga meditation to the universal community who crave for ultimate goal of self realisation has itself became the veil covering the ultimate reality. it is unfortunate that the gullible followers allowed some vested interests to exploit them for selfish gains and thereby lost precious time. there is no point to brood over the past but treat them with negligence they deserve as otherwise they may play havock on all concerned.

The best solution to this problem is to continue our practice without bothering about the obstacles in the form of these individuals, and as assured by The Adi guru and Founder of this system the restless craving and helpless cry of a sincere abhyasi makes the Eternal Master who is one with the Ultimate certainly comes to the rescue of the true followers and punish those who violate their guidlines with a severe punishment they deserve most.

It is in the interest of our own progress we should not deviate from the chosen path of becoming one with the Master who merged in toto with the Ultimate to guide the Humanity at large to reach the main goal of Human life that is to become one with the special personality who came down to this world to lead us all to that goal.All we need to do now is to keep that goal in our mind and remain attached only to Him and none else.


Hi Jogarao...

Welcome to the discussion...

You say: "...who crave for ultimate goal of self realisation has itself became the veil covering the ultimate reality."

Do you think that "self-realization" can cover the ULTIMATE REALITY? Does not "self-realization" mean that one realizes the TRUE self, not a copy or a "fake" version of the SELF... unless you mean a "fake" version of "self-realization", that is not a 'realization" of the self at all, but of an "illusion"...

Who is it that "covers the Ultimate REALITY with "self-realization"?

You say: " ... reach the main goal of Human life that is to become one with the special personality who came down to this world to lead us all to that goal"

Does Lalaji mention a "special personality"? Who beside Babuji mentions a "special personality"? Should there not be a lot of others who mention such a PERSON?

Where do you find that Babuji is the SPECIAL PERSONALITY beside in SAHAJ MARG?
Babuji never said he was "the SPECIAL PERSONALITY"... The only ones who I heard it said is from Chari... Do you know of anyone else?

Do anyone in the RAMASHRAM of Lalaji think that Sahaj Marg is now the ONLY PATH as Babuji stated in his letter of 1963 that is on the "Naqshbandiyya Nexus" site of the Lalaji Family (Dinesh, the Dean of the Naqshbandiyya Order "NaqshMuMRa". Dinesh is #39 and Lalaji is #36. Babuji is not on their GOLDEN chain and was never a Preceptor of Lalaji's group and only met him a few times.

Thanks for you comments and replies to this query..

Cyril Borg...


Hi Cyril,
It is very nice of you to comment on my post.
When I stated that the simplicity with which Lalaji and Babuji propagated the system that simplicity itself made people think that it is very difficult to follow the system because most of us think in complications instead of simple thinking.This simplicity has been misunderstood due to our limited thinking that it is very difficult to realise self.where as Lalaji and Babuji proved beyond doubt that any complicated thinking diverts his/her attention from the main goal because simplicity is also subtle and sensitive and slightest deviation is enough for a down fall.

The no of books written by Babuji such as Reality at Dawn, Efficacy of Rajyog in the light of ahajmarg Commentary on Ten commandments ,Towards Infinity etc.. besides his auto biography in three volumes published by the shahjahanpur centre reveals many aspects of this sadhana and one can understand the system in right perspective.

It is our misfortune that we have with us a very few direct followers who too lead the same kind of simple life and leave the rest to destiny because nature will take its own time to settle scores for it is tolerent enough to wait and we too are required to be like that if we want that ultimate which is beyond explanation but which can be experienced alone.The practice is purely individualistic in the sense that our experiences differ due to our individual past but mind you we are all going to reach the final goal if we do not deviate and depend on Him alone who only can take us there.

But if we continue our practice as laid down by Babuji since he brought this system into this world by the grace of His Master Lalaji Maharaj, no force on earth prevent us to reach that goal. Babuji in his auto biography mentioned about that special personality but never claimed himself as that personality. The abhyasis around him by their individual experiences realised his real person and got benefitted by His direct instructions.


Hi Jogarao...

Thank you for your replies...

I can see (read) that you are a good person (male/female?) and that the teachings of Babuji have remained a source of good in your life. I have noticed that in other groups also, such as the ISRC of Narayana, specially his father, Dr. Varadachari, and even in some of the leaderless schisms in Europe who still meet in small groups and do not join in with the Chari faction.

I believe that the Chari Group (SRCM(California) is the PROBLEM in all our lives and for the SRCM in general. I am sure that Chari thinks that after he is gone, his successor will attempt at "ecumenism" as the Catholic Church has tried for centuries without much success. The Divisions have remained.

I agree with you that it is unfortunate that a person who is not properly trained in "spirituality" is now leading the SRCM (California), and hence has created so many divisions in the families of the disciples who's mates can't accept this "star" syndrome that has to follow such "bad teaching". Poor Babuji! Wether there is "punishment" on this Earth, for the divisions of PEOPLE to the level of "trade-mark" and violence is yet to be seen. Hence many "seekers" believe in another life or many other lives to balance our actions, believing that the ONE is JUST, and that in ITS Creation, there should also be JUSTICE. That is a belief and not a FACT, or a TRUTH, and is yet to be seen (by me) or confirmed (shown or proven) by others.

I pray that when I see the POOR, or the SICK and the VICTIMS, I don't just turn my back and say: "You are just paying for past deeds". But I hope that I and all will continue to be guided by compassion and Charity and lend a hand as much as I can, if only in my words and thoughts, and hopes and prayers.

I Bless you and yours...

Cyril Borg


Hi Cyril,
I would like to clarify further as follows:
There is every possibility to mistake one who feels that he realized self since in such a state as declared by Babuji himself one forgets self completely and if anyone declares himself that he realized self then it is false claim altogether. No one so far , even among the loyal followers of Babuji declared that he realized self or ultimate but simply say I don't Know since he forgets himself completely and remains in the remembrance of HIS mASTER WHO AGAIN TOTALLY MERGED HIMSELF INTO ULTIMATE REALITY and beyond.It is up to us only to use our discrimination and decide whether that person who declares himself as Master really deserves our attention or not. Another thing is we too experience such forgetful condition when we are near such realized personalities and that is the real proof about their condition.
We have come across such realized souls in persons like Late Raghavendra rao of raichur and experienced that condition though for a short while. It has been verified with other abhyasis and confirmed by self. They remind us the presence of such special personality though they never claim as such but we can deduce it by our personal experience.
We normally look at things or persons and form our opinion according to our impressions and past experience. Unfortunately if we fall into the hands of such imposters we too will be carried away by their false images till we come accross spiritually elevated personalities and there by get rid of those false impressions.Let us wait for such a moment patiently without losing heart but with positive expectation. Just understand that unless we are aware of pain we can not experience pleasure and unless we are aware of evil tendencies we can not experience relief from them.All these words are out of my own experience and I have not been prompted by any external agency.
I pray Master to bestow us with such experiences so that we may not deviate from the chosen path and reach our destination.


Hi Jogarao...


Is there such a "beyond" the Ultimate reality? Does not the word: ULTIMATE mean that nothing is "beyond" or "more ULTIMATE" than IT?

You say: "It is up to us only to use our discrimination and decide whether that person who declares himself as Master really deserves our attention or not. Another thing is we too experience such forgetful condition when we are near such realized personalities and that is the real proof about their condition."

How can one use "discrimination", without using the "brain" and not simply being "obedient" as the GURU culture demands? It seems that one has to "not be obedient" and ready to use the BRAIN, and not the Heart, which is the body's pump for blood, before one can truly "discriminate".

Then if one is in a "forgetful condition" when in the proximity of such "realized personalities", then one can't discriminate about them at all... One has to be able to "remember" so as to formulate a "thought" of any depth, that is not driven simply by a "emotional desire" or bodily "need" or necessity.

I don't doubt your experience but by what you say, it is very "subjective" and you seem to have "accepted" Mr Roa as your Master so you have a different experience of him than I, who have only read some of his material on the blog of his disciples. I have to discriminate from his "intellect", logic, words, etc... as I am not in his presence and can't experience his "energy". I will simply take your word for Mr. Rao's spirituality or psychic energy level.

Thank you for sharing your experience....

Cyril Borg


Dear jogarao,

Welcome to our orkut web-community, incorporated to exchange free and independent views about sahaj marg in general and shree ram chandra mission (
california based) in specific.

it is imperative to know what are the views of some of the main contributors here, as it will give a fair bit of idea of what we are discussing.

You have stated The simplicity with which Lalaji and Babuji propagated this system of pranahuthi aided Raja yoga meditation

Probably you missed to get the essence of the topic we are discussing here, we are trying to come to a logical conclusion for the statement made in SRCM (california) website that lalaji appointed babuji as his representative.

We do not have much idea about functioning of lalaji and his acts, because there are various contradictory statements made by numerous groups claiming linage from lalaji, all of them however say that lalaji discovered the "pranahuti" some call it transmission, some call it transmission linked meditation and some call it a sufi practice, most strangely Chari's group call it "modified version of raja yoga".

Nomenclature of lalaji's concept is not the topic of discussion, but did Lalaji appointed babuji as his representative is the question here.

All the groups associated with sahaj marg of Ramchandra (Babuji) sing in single voice that babuji had a dream in
1945, in which he was asked by lalaji to start sahaj marg.

We doubt the validity of this claim. It is perfectly OK to have a dream and register sahaj marg based on that dream, but illusion must not be presented as fact, a dream is a dream.... we all have dreams everyday and many of us, follow our dreams as well, but we make clear distinction in between a dream and reality (of the senses we live in). Making a claim which is out of this world MUST be stated as such.

Illusion should be clearly stated as illusion and any attempt to present illusion as reality for mass consumption is a dis-honest approach.


Dear Brothers,
I think I must make my point more clear. Babuji never claimed that he was appointed as the representative of Lalaji , rather he quoted Lalaji as His Master and the transmission comes directly from Lalaji alone. What happened later was In memory of His Master he founded Ramchandra mission and he was the founder president to carry on the work entrusted to him by Lalaji. Babuji preferred himself to be treated as servant to all abhyasis and used to appeal to take his service for their progress. He treated every abhyasi as his brother and expected similar response but never claimed as master.If anybody happen to read his biography he used to eagerly await abhyasis to 'try' the practice at least for three months and continue only if found satisfied.So far as my understanding goes Transmission comes from the ultmate source if the tranmitter is tuned up totally with the source and any deviation from it will have adverse effects on the receiver.
Babuji himself advised all abhyasis to follow His Master and never talked about his Master hood.It is the abhyasis who treated as such in the physical absence of Lalaji. Even myself, I never treated any one as Master but sincerely followed senior brothers who clarified most of my doubts about this system and only after I was satisfied I took this practise seriously but I must admit that I still feel that I am a new entrant even today. That is the freshness of this dynamic system.
Bro.Raghavendra Rao suggested that one should try to adhere oneself to the ten commandments and the rest follows automatically. we need to analyze our daily routine life and correct ourselves without any external support and judge our progress by ourselves which will come to our cognizance once we cross that stage and thus we ourselves can understand where we stand in our sadhana.
more in my next post


"Babuji never claimed that he was appointed as the representative of Lalaji"

Well this is a contradictory statement from what is made publicly by
Chari clan, here is what they have stated in their website:-

August 14, 1931, Lalaji passed away, leaving Babuji to continue his work for the upliftment of humankind.


June 3, 1922, Babuji first met his Master (Lalaji), a man with the same name as himself, who lived in the town of Fatehgarh not far from Shahjahanpur. Lalaji recognized Babuji as the man who had appeared to him in a dream years before, the one who was destined to succeed him as the leader of a great spiritual renaissance.

This is very strange when we have similar claims like the one i have posted in first post

"His most beloved disciple Rev. Dr. Srikrishan LaUi Maharaj was proclaimed as saint vested with full spiritual powers by Rev. Lala ji Maharaj in his life time itself, who continued the mission of his Master from 1931 onwards from his Ramashram located at Sikandarabad (UP.)"

Now why should one claim be accepted and other rejected? because at max only one of these claims can be true!! so who is the impostor here???

If we analysis both the claims, one states that lalaji appointed Dr. Srikrishan LaUi Maharaj as his representative during his lifetime, and other claims that in the very first meeting lalaji appointed babuji as his representative, but babuji got the dream 13 years after lalaji's death..

Dr. Srikrishan LaUi Maharaj's claims seems more logical and real, we can go on a live in our dreams and each and everyone of us can claim to have certain dream and go on fighting court battles based on our dreams.... this is exactly what is happening in sahaj marg today!

Well is this spiritual? I doubt it.

Hence we can attempt to study method of babuji independently and isolating it from any association from lalaji. This approach will be more logical and we can come to an agreement if we decide to accept the glaring reality in front of us.

Lalaji did not appointed Babuji as his successor, it was simply an illusion on part of babuji to claim that he is propagating lalaji's teaching exclusively.

If lalaji had appointed someone else what is the need for him to appear in dream of babuji and make statement which would contradict his real life acts??

At this point i do not wish to discuss validity of sahaj marg as a system, we will come to it in some time, but as of now, we need to close this discussion (after reaching a conclusion) that lalaji as he is known to the world has got nothing to do with the practice of sahaj marg.

There is no harm in giving credit of sahja marg to lalaji, but it must be stated that it is a claim which cannot be proved and cannot be accepted in any discussion. This fact is important to be exposed because
Chari makes absurd statements based on this assumption like "it is an order from lalaji that abhyasis should marry each other".

How can lalaji order such a thing when he was not at all related to concept of sahaj marg itself?

A story from mahabharat is quite valid here, the story of Eklavya, who practiced archery by making an idol of Dronacharya, there is nothing wrong, but his objectives were quite clear, story also marks a clear distinction between reality and illusion, Eklavya paid a heavy price for his illusion, by loosing all that he gained by his own effort but crediting it to his imagination.

This is what has happened. Lalaji in all probability was unaware of any such person named Ramchandra of Shahjahanpur. Lalaji being a spiritual person and associated with a particular school of thought (Sufism) must be meeting with thousands of people. Babuji was just one of them.

What about honesty?


Dear Brothers,

Babuji by his example has shown how a devoted abhyasi has to behave and exhorted others to taste the nectar of spiritual growth by by emulating his example and used to declare that he takes poison but give nectar instead when questioned about his Hukka smoking habit. I wondered why such an elevated personality got addicted to Hukka. Later I learnt that it was to bring him down to amidst us since most of the time he was in that super conscious state making him totally silent and practically living dead condition.His endless struggle to spread the message of his master to pining masses made him ignorant of the fact that promoting chari as general secretary will help him to spread His Master's message to west and Europe and that was the beginning of chari's getting prominence among other abhyasis.

Babuji never suspected that his own follower by way of his misdeeds bring down the glorious image of this Mission with the same speed with which he established his own regime taking advantage of the physical absence of both the personalities and silent following of gullible abhyasis.

But nature will take its own course to set the matters right and now the result is obvious.The need of the hour is to wake up all those who are still under the spell of chari and invite them with open heart to get back to the serious sadhana brushing away the past and hope for a better future.

There is no point in brooding over the ugly past but our attention should be on the present to prevent further deterioration in future. Every earnest seeker of spirituality is expected to keep vigilant always to avoid exploitation by vested interests.God is great and I am sure that his benevolent grace will be showered on all those who are true, honest and sincere followers of spiritual path and weed out the unwanted with due punishment.Our attention should be on the process for progress but not on individuals since the thought itself separates us from our main goal of life.


We are not denying the possibility that babuji might have experienced something supernatural, we are yet to discuss and come to a conclusion about it, but in my opinion what is pretty clear by now, is lalaji was babuji's guru in similar manner as Dronacharya was Eklavya's guru "imaginary".

Now if babuji has credited all his achievements to lalaji, that's his view, and should be accept like that only, "In babuji's view, lalaji was his guru" but lalaji in reality appointed someone else as his representative.

By accepting this fact we are not diminishing acts of babuji, all we are doing is making the air more clear. Lalaji's association with sahaj marg is hypothetical, and hence claims made by chari like "Order from lalaji that abhyasis should marry each other" should be thrown in the dustbin, and he must be prosecuted for making such an statement which is an absolute insult to our common sense.

Stupidity is not spirituality. there has to be some trace of logic behind enlightenment, a person making claims that he is talking to ghosts is best referred to as a madman, and not an enlighten person, selling messages from ghosts claiming that these messages are from brighter world is "rape of intelligence". Why would a person like babuji hate his own children? why would babuji send messages from brighter world to those people who have brutally exploited female members of babuji's family?

We are humans because we can think, and it has been proven by the history and various religions that to reach God, we must be human first, and this is the logic behind various "Avtar's" of Lord Vishnu.

If we drop our intelligence, if we drop our thinking capacity, if we drop our logic, how are we different from an obedient dog? even dogs can think rationally, if their master orders him to jump in fire, he won't as he understands that such an act will cause him harm, if you beat your pet, he will try to save himself.

We need to be human to be enlighten. and to be human we have no other option but to think.


It seems that those who follow Babuji and now Chari do not want to address the claim that Lalaji was used to give credibility to Babuji' s Mission. He could have joined the "representative" of Lalaji if he wanted to "serve" and be "obedient" to Lalaji. It seems to show a lack of respect for Lalaji that he simply formed his own group and place Lalaji as the "Master" and "inventor" of his system. To say that Lalaji "inspired" him is correct but from there the claims of "successorship" are a little "stretched".

I have many wise persons who have inspired me in my life, but I don't claim that they are responsible for the systems I create in the future. And if I was to follow their teachings and their METHOD, I would learn from his "stated" successor and representative and not present myself as a "successor" or a "representative" of my MASTER from a "dream" message... That is also a stretch..

The "that's the past" claim is what all autocrats and their "disciples" want to scream, but the past is still being "proselytized" by Chari and his gang, as if it is still the TRUTH and that they are part of LALAJI's Lineage... So it is not the "PAST" but it is the PRESENT that we can FIX... IT is the only thing we can FIX.

What Babuji did was his business, and his spirituality is his affair with the ONE ... If any want to follow Babuji, that is one thing... If they claim Lalaji as their LINEAGE, that seems to be a LIE as Lalaji has a ligitimate lineage with documents to prove it. Sahaj Marg and SRCM do not have such documentation...

I pray that all adherents to Sahaj marg have not fallen into "forgetfulness" and hence have given up the ability to be "discriminating" and logical. That Brain is also a GIFT from the ONE that we did not deserve but is ours by GRACE.

Let us use our GIFT of THINKING, without FEAR!!

Cyril Borg...


Dear Brothers,
It is clear to me now that your opinion of sahajmarg was entirely on the basis of your experience in chari group. I only wonder how was it possible for you to bear this agony and harassment for such a long time?
My experience was no doubt chari could create a good impression on people in the beginning but seekers with real craving for spiritual experience will immediately get averse from such situations and people and as far as my personal experience I too got attracted to his person after reading his book titled My Master but after meeting him in person i did not feel anything and never tried to meet him again.
What I am trying to state is that you will normally guided by your impressions to form opinions but you can change them according to your experience till you develop discrimination to avoid unpleasant situations and people so that we will not be effected in any ways.
I feel that just like a hungry man we search for spiritual solution and some times land up with some smart fellow who hoodwinks us into his trap and before we realise we fall a prey to his is not his greatness but our foolishness to accept such fellows as Gurus, Masters, Or guides. We need to thoroughly cross check his credentials before we submit ourselves just like inquiry about a Doctor before consultation.
Before I started this practice I had to search for a true guide for 25 years and try more than ten different systems.Only after I was fully satisfied that this is the most suitable procedure when compared to other practices and thoroughly satisfied myself about this system I developed faith and confidence in Babuji's system.


Hi Jogarao...

I too believe in "meditation" and in "prayer" and can plainly see that they are not the "property" of any person even Babuji who was never my Master but a "friend" as you are on my JOURNEY...

This being said, I live in constant "contact" with the ONE and the SPIRIT in IT'S Creation and hence I don't have to "remember" constantly any one PERSON, Personality, Image, SOUND, but can live in the MOMENT with the SPIRIT that is ALWAYS THERE where I live...

However, since the "manipulators" came to my "PERFECT UNIVERSE", I must deal with them and shine the LIGHT of REASON on the experience they had on my "partner"( another friend) and could have on my friends, family, society, UNIVERSE, etc...

I then leave My one(me) in ONE, and my one (I) in ALL all the time and in all the SPACE of MULTI-dimensions and deal with "SHINING THE LIGHT of REASON" here in this VIRTUAL space of 0 and 1 or "switch-on" and/or "switch-off". That I do so as to alert my fellow "sojourners" who could now be in peril and the manipulators go into 'spiritualism" and the chanelling of the spirits of the DEAD... Other religions that have tried to fool with that before our "mental health" establishment, started to create "encyclopedias" of demons or "demonology"...

Baal is one such GOD/DEMON that means Master in one culture but Demon in the surrounding cultures. When the Master become the Political Power, there is "corruption" and the surrounding cultures are invaded anused for "money", labour, volunteerism, slavery, or just raw POWER to invade and operate in another culture, and not adhering to the laws of those states regarding our societal evolution over the centuries as we challenged the POWER of the DUALITY of STATE/RELIGION. .... con't

One example is "homosexuality"... They are protected in our secular legislation and our "charitable" and "tax-exempt" status is hinged on adhering to our "liberalism" toward the rights of "homosexuals". That is higher that the standards of the Master of SRCM and must be exposed and "opposed" until it is either recanted and recalled or the "tax-exempt" status under the umbrella of "Charity" is removed for this organization and this person. Directors in our "non-profit" societies are "accountable" for their words and actions. That should hold for other "nationals" who do business in our "nation". Even RELIGION and SPIRITUAL GROUPS are not immune to that FREEDOM anymore. The Media (us... the bloggers) are insisting that our "servants" address that "injustice" perpetrated by RELIGIOUS autocrats NOW...and YES, WE CAN!! We have the Shashwats of the world with their "techno skills"... WE can decide on the ISSUES in "initiatives" and vote on the issues "online" in "dynamic" (on-going) processes.

That is the new "economy" which must include the "virtual" world of technology as a repository of our "economies" which originate as a negative or a "minus" -3, -2, -1, 0, +1,+3,+3,+4,+5,+6,+7,+ for an octave (spectrum of light and sound).

I understand that we, the older generation, can't live in the house of tomorrow, but we can empower the "youth" and the next generation to use their skills to create a BETTER and not so "DIVISIVE" world that the SPIRITUALITY of SAHAJ MARG has created in my WORLD and my LIFE.

Now I will expose it until it changes... not me, but Shashwat, my sons, and other "adherents" to a philosophy of LOGIC and INTELLECT as a complement to FAITH, and BELIEF... and not in OPPOSITION or DIVIDING with such RELIGIO/SPIRITUALISM or "pseudo-spirituality".... Shashwat's and my life were 'negatively" impacted by Sahaj marg and its creation, specially Chari but not just Chari... Babuji has some "explaining to do, but he is humble so we'll believe his "good intention"... we already do... cont'

Before I started this process, I communicated often with Babuji to check his "feeling"... and it was always a smile... I also checked with other deceased members Sahaj mag when Chari became "BOSS", and they also "SMILED"... So I thanked them and now I just ask NATURE and the ONE... and until I get a different approach from SRCM that they will UNITE and stop the BS, then I WILL POINT AT THEM and their ACTIONS and their WORDS, so the rest of the SEEKERS will not be "ENDANGERED" by the dangeous games of "neophytes" in the SPIRITUALITY games...

We are all attached to our EMOTIONS and to our INTELLECT and to vilify the one that makes us "moral" and sensible" is not a "GOOD IDEA"... And it is not the HEART...
Our secular laws are loftier that the "developer's", no tomorrow, attitude that our children don't swallow any more... The "END OF THE WORLD" does the same for them that "THE BOMB" did for us... it stresses us and we become "rebels" or we become "ruthless" and "profiteers" and "egotistical"... If we can't be rich, we'll become famous, and why not the MASTER OF THE UNIVERSE... Developers playing at RELIGION and not being too careful of the "environment" and the "psyche" of others, let alone the silly SPIRITUALISM.... Where is HOUDINI to debunk these Charlatans?

Thanks for reading it.... You're crazier than me... I just write this stuff... I never read it... lol ;-)) I am Acadian and we "joke" You gotta laugh, b'cause It AIN'T funny...

NOW I'll go talk to the flowers and my dog... and you will be "indoors, in your "mind" or "virtual" space, and I will be in contact with the SPIRIT of FLOWER and DOG and NATURE...STARS, GALAXIES, etc...UNIVERSE, ONE...ZERO.... MINUS ONE... Wow..What an '"achievement".... And I never saw my NAVEL once... or my "heart"...or my MIND... Or MY SPIRIT but the ONE....and the ZERO...and the MINUS ONE...

Yes we can...


Cyril Borg...


Dear Brother,
I could understand your objective very clearly.Yes! It is the responsibilty of every sane person to ascertain whether he is on the right track or there is any curvature .

I feel sorry for the plight of those who fell into the hands of unscrupulous fellows and wriggling to get out of their influence. But one need not continue to suffer any more the moment they realise that they are being exploited because of their innoscence.Let them take a bold step and come out of their clutches if they feel suffocated as a result.

The purpose of this practice is to get rid of all complexities and become transparent and fearless to anything that interferes with self and keep the final objective of returning back to orignality which is simple, pure and perfect. our personal experience itself hints at that condition to reach. One needs to be selfish to the extent of his practice and be careful about any exploitation in the name of Master or Guru and immediately dis connect himself to avoid further exploitation.

May god bless all those who crave such freedom ,and grace them with all necessary strength,and health till they achiebve their objective


The purpose of this practice is to get rid of all complexities and become transparent and fearless to anything that interferes with self and keep the final objective of returning back to orignality which is simple, pure and perfect

We are yet to discuss the practice, as of now, in this thread, we are discussing how in the world Ram Chandra Saxena is related to Lalaji???

Dear Jagorao, you have not yet replied to this question which we are trying to find an answer.....

Practice can be good or bad, we have discussed this before and will discuss it again and again and again till our logic is not satisfied. because you propagate this practice, hence you are responsible and answerable to society at large, we all are if we decide to get public with our views...

more or less we have reached this conclusion that babuji was not directly related to lalaji, but made up this story and "imagined" that he is representative of lalaji... if this is true then we can move to the next aspect which is practice.

Lets gather enough courage to face the truth, we all have at some point in our life encountered a poem by Rudyard kipling "IF"

If you can make one heap of all your winnings
And risk it on one turn of pitch-and-toss,
And lose, and start again at your beginnings
And never breath a word about your loss;

Yours is the Earth and everything that's in it,
And - which is more - you'll be a Man my son!

This is the attitude we need to have when we seek the truth.

Dear jagorao, are you at the age of 63 yrs and a life long association with sahaj marg, imagining transmission from babuji, willing to risk this association and accept the truth that babuji "made up" his association with lalaji and at best was a madman?

If you can may be you can realize the truth and it will help you a long way in reaching the goal which was in your mind when you took this path of sahaj marg, start over again, forget sahaj marg, seek the truth do not imagine truth.

Feb 12


I would say that the goal of SRCM to "remove complexities" has not been reached as the complexities in the Lalaji to Babuji LINEAGE is very COMPLEX and seems to lack in "honesty" and honour...

To claim to represent someone who has two organization already, Ramashram, and Naqshbandiyaa (NaqshMuMRa), from a dream is not very "removing complexities" from LIFE of the adherents but is "complicating" their existence.

I believe that Babuji seemed humble and we can forgive him a lot because of this appearance of humility from there to claim that this person can save on or erase one's samskaras is stretching credibility. But all are FREE to do whatever they want to ...

But in a conversation such as this, one has to make sense, be logical and stick to the subject at hand and not forever repeat the same "company line" about the MASTER, the METHOD and the MISSION, ignoring the founder's actions, , his foundation and the philosophy and the words that are spoken to lure others to this crumbling and divided structure.

NO one will save anyone ... If we believed that, then we should then follow someone who says they are a Messiah, a GOD (if there is ONE) or at the very least, the SON of this GOD and not simple a "SPECIAL PERSONALITY" or a MASTER ... or a GURU. One follows a guru to learn his skill or art. Removing complexities is not something that Ram Chandra is or his organization, and/or Chari are " MASTERS" at.

We just want to conclude that Babuji did not follow the RAmashram of Dr. Chatterbhuj or the NaqshMuMra for "political" reasons. Islam? Sufi? Not Hindu enough? There are no other reasons... specially that they try to make it a "Raja Yoga" rather than a SUFI path... And then to deny the Sufi path of Lalaji is almost a "complex" insult to Lalaji and his lineage.

Cyril Borg....


//Dear jagorao, are you at the age of 63 yrs and a life long association with sahaj marg, imagining transmission from babuji, willing to risk this association and accept the truth that babuji "made up" his association with lalaji and at best was a madman?

If you can may be you can realize the truth and it will help you a long way in reaching the goal which was in your mind when you took this path of sahaj marg, start over again, forget sahaj marg, seek the truth do not imagine truth. //

Well dear brother,
My experience so far made me to conclude that Iam On right path but Iam not able to do justice to my practice because I feel contented with my progress so far.Yes! Even Swami Ramakrishna pramahamsa was misunderstood as mad man by people but only Swami Vivekanand could catch up with the spiritual greatness of Ramakrishna pramamahamsa and the rest is known to all .Spritual practice is such a method in which one need to taste the condition and then he practically becomes mad after that experience and hence appear so. Even the preceptor who introduced me to this system of practice appeared to me as a mad man in the beginning but after my close association with him I realised his capability as a preceptor.
He was a pracicing Doctor(Eye specialist) and he nerrated this following incident.
Once in 1965 he happend to see the photo of babuji and being an eye specialist he realised immediately that Babuji is really a spiritual oriented person and he can be trusted.What he saw in that photo is the eye balls were in the etreme opposit corners of the eyes . This kind of vision is normally seen either in a dead person or a highly spiritually elevated person .Babuji used to be in that living dead condition and I could visualise that condition only after my encounter with this doctor who really helped me to understand this system during my association with him for 5 years till his end in 1995.This is not only my experience alone but every one who entered this practice under his guidance as preceptor. (to be contd)


It is not imagination but real experience and I have no regrets about it. What more evidence you need that such a good number of followers of this system through Babuji have sacrificed their lives to spread this system among scores of common people like me and how can I be a silent spectator when some vested interests are exploiting serious seekers like you?

No doubt that the simplicity of this system of practice itself is the veil on its reality as most of us are accustomed to complicated situations but never exposed to simple realities like simple living and high thinking which is the basic quality of a true human being and are we fit enough to be termed asHuman beings in that sense? Babuji said we try to pick a pin on the ground using a crane, instead of our own hands and act likewise when confronted with problems of life and living.

Our complicated thinking made us to suspect any strange experience with the result that we suspect first and believe in any thing only with experience otherwise and drag on it till we lose patience and feel frustrated.

We need to live like a swan which floats in the water but will not bear even a drop on its body once come out of the water. we have to learn to live on daily basis concerned with the present without brooding over bitter past or dreaming about un ripe future.We can do anythinhg now only for it is in our hands as otherwise we lose this opportunity for life once this moment is gone into the oblivion.My sincere suggestion if you care to follow is continue your search for right guru for you leaving behind unpleasant situations and people for nature to take its own course on them and be selfish to gain that rare spiritual experience but caution those who are still wriggling with suffocation to lead a life full of peace, calmness and tranqulity.Since Iam benefitted much with this system , I feel that as many people as possible get benefitted so that we can form into a community above religion, caste or colour for a society with equality and unity as its base.


Giving credit is one thing, which is acceptable and something honorable as well, but claiming "exclusive" successor-ship is a fraud.

We have a letter from Ram chandra saxena, published by family members of lalaji which states that babuji modified the system proposed by lalaji, to make it more politically correct, if we take the letter from babuji in 1963, claims of other linage's of lalaji and babuji's own admission, we can safely conclude that:-

Ramchandra Saxena alias "babuji" was not an appointed representative of lalaji, but was one of his admirer's

This will then seal the position of Parthasarthi Rajagopalachari as a liar, manipulator, cunning beast, disguised as human, for the statement he made

Lalaji Maharaj, whose birth anniversary we are celebrating today has ordained–it was not merely an expression of his wishes–has ordained that abhyasis should marry amongst each other

http: //www. srcm. org/literature/recent. speeches/070202_Tiruppur. jsp

How can lalaji order such a thing? is this not fooling people? how many marriages were arranged by Ramchandra Saxena? because it was him who use to communicate with lalaji "in his dreams".

Given the fact that we know, from babuji himself, that he did not meet lalaji more then 2-3 times, it is insane to assume that lalaji appointed him as his representative, babuji claims so, or accepted lalaji as his Guru is another thing, and has no logical value. Anyone can claim anything, and we all are free to interpret it according to our own understanding. But such claims should be presented as they are... it is again insane to assume that lalaji ordered babuji to modify his method and make it more "politically correct", if this was lalaji's intention, he would have done it himself.

So i hope we have agreed to this that lalaji was not babuji's guru, but it was babuji who assumed this.

We can move to next topic, if this is agreeable to everyone in this forum.

We will discuss the points raised by you in the thread you have started, points i am interested in, which you have raised are:-

1. My experience so far made me to conclude that Iam On right path

2. Even Swami Ramakrishna pramahamsa was misunderstood as mad man by people

3. 1965 he happend to see the photo of babuji and being an eye specialist he realised immediately that Babuji is really a spiritual oriented person

4. What more evidence you need that such a good number of followers of this system

5. No doubt that the simplicity of this system of practice itself is the veil on its reality

6. Babuji said we try to pick a pin on the ground using a crane, instead of our own hands and act likewise when confronted with problems of life and living.

7. My sincere suggestion if you care to follow is continue your search for right guru for you leaving behind unpleasant situations and people for nature to take its own course on them

I broadly agree with rest of your statement, these points which i have pointed out are of spacial interest to me, and am looking forward to discuss these aspects with you, and allow me to clarify as why i want to keep these discussion in separate threads.

It is for three reasons:-

1. Readability gets lot easier and any person who is reading this thread is not tossed off topic, and can come to the conclusion regarding the topic we are discussing.

2. All these discussion will be published again on internet in form of pdf so that those who are not on orkut also get a change to read the particular topic without breaks and need to refer to different topic off orkut.

3. These discussion will form a large database of information regarding the topics we are discussing for those who are seeking information.

We have a confirmation from Kasturi Chaturvedi, wherein people associated with her have accepted that lalaji is not at all related to babuji and his sahaj marg, this is what we have been saying for quite some time, we were able to demonstrate the same with evidence, it is good to see that there are some people who are still somewhat honest, and accept the faults done by others and agree that which is evident and do not block their thinking in mindless obsession of associating lalaji with sahaj marg, just because a jerk claims that it is an order from lalaji that members of his cult must marry each other!!

here is what panditji a close associate and de-facto public relation officer of kasturi chaturvedi has to say about lalaji's association with sahaj marg.

also few more thing i would like to tell
Sri Ram chandra's mission is babuji's mission and started by babuji not by lalaji, lalaji had sant mat which is still there in fatehgarh ..

Now the same question arises again, people following babuji say it clearly that lalaji is not associated with sahaj marg, chari say's that it is an order from lalaji that abhyasis should marry each other!!

When lalaji is not associated with what
Chari is propagating, how come they follow orders from lalaji and those who are directly propagating teachings of lalaji, have no clue as when this order was made!!

This makes it clear enough that Chari is a cunning manipulator who does not hesitate to fool people, lies are on his tong, if he opens his mouth, he will speak lie.

Alas there are people who believe that such a person is spiritual, is calling Parthasarthi Rajagopalachari as spiritual not an insult to this term, spiritual??

It is very important that we all should know that
Chari is fooling people in name of spirituality, his deeds and lies must be exposed and presented to public for scrutiny.

I urge people to open their minds and see deeds as they are, and not with a closed mind, which only listens to voice of their master.

panditji comments can be found here http: // kasturibhenji. blogspot. com , check the comment section, comment number 159.

Additional comments about the same topic but made elsewhere

Shashwat said (here) :


If we have to find the truth of SRCM, we will have to focus on 1945, when SRCM was formulated.

This area of history is somewhat clear as not much contradictory statements are made by any of clans, they all say "Lalaji appointed babuji as his representative" is this is the truth?

Answer is clearly NO Lalaji did not appointed babuji as his successor. babuji had a dream, and appointed himself as lalaji's representative..

Wrong starts from there, SRCM and sahaj marg is based on this lie.. how can SRCM and sahaj marg lead to truth when it is based on a lie??

We need not explore what happened in 1982-83 as only lies and manipulation happened at that time, and it happened because sahaj marg was based in these very lies and manipulation.

Concept of sahaj marg is fundamentally wrong, we will see more such segmentation of SRCM in near future and then the future victims of sahaj marg will analyze what happened in 2011-12 (say!!). Such analysis will not lead to truth, if we have to find the truth of sahaj marg we will have to analyze the roots of sahaj marg.

And my analysis indicates, its illusion, hallucination, mental diseases, madness and psychological illness which are the foundation of Sahaj marg, and this analysis is supported by what is evident clearly today, the outcome of sahaj marg, madness, mental illness and hallucination.

Here is the proof of what i say:-

mental diseases Hallucination, madness and psychological illness

Sunday, February 15, 2009

Leaving Sahaj Marg.

Most of the people who are trapped in this cult of Sahaj marg, feel helpless when they realize that they have been deceived, this is because brainwashing and mind control of Shree Ram Chandra Mission is based purely on emotional manipulation.

To understand the psychology of a man trapped in this cult of sahaj marg, we can take an example, as an analogy we can take example of a marriage, consider the condition of a man, who is deeply in love with his wife, and his wife, apparently shows him love and commitment towards the relation, but later the man finds out that his wife has been the biggest cheat and manipulator that he has ever known, the man come’s to know that his wife has not only cheated him, but she developed the relation with him, keeping a particular aim in sight, and used him for many years before he finally came to know the truth!!!

The situation of the man, as explained above is the situation faced by the members of sahaj marg, when they realize that they have been deceived, manipulated and cheated, they feel deeply hurted, but because of their emotional attachment, and dependency on preceptor and transmission, they are neither able to leave sahaj marg, nor able to continue with it.

People with any kind of addiction like cigarette, drinking, or drugs, have already experienced the consequences of addiction. Such kind of people know very well, that smoking is causing them harm, drinking is causing them harm, but they feel helpless in front of their desires, and they are enslaved by these addiction and finally if they are not able to conquer their addiction problem, these addictions eventually eats them up!!

Same is true with addiction of transmission, infect any kind of addiction is very harmful for psychological health, and plays an important role in weakening the will power of the victim

Depending on the level of attachment, some people are able to leave and become normal sooner than others who find it hard to realize a life without sahaj marg.

I will cite an living example for this, take the case of debashis,, who has recently left Chari group, but is still looking for some kind of help in order to get out from the trap of sahaj marg, his post is published in messages section of blog about Kasturi Chaturvedi.

Dear Brother,
I am an abhyasi currently located in Singapore. I have been practising Sahaj Marg since 1993. We used to have a very knowledgable preceptor named Brother Bala who was appointed a preceptor by Babuji in 1977 and I used to practice under his guidance. Unfortunately, brother Bala passed away in 2007 and since then we have been quite disillusioned by the new management. I feel that we are moving far away from spirituality and becoming a commercial organization.
I protested against the state of affairs and was ostracised and harassed in several ways. Since then I have stopped going to the Satsanghs.

There are several interested seekers here who are looking for guidance…. We donot have any good preceptors after Brother Bala to guide us. There are some abhyasis who have practised for over 10 years and decided to discontinue the practice because of the new management. Could you please discuss this situation with Sister Kasturi and let us know how to pursue our spiritual journey? Since we are physically far away, is it possible to give us a distance sitting or appoint a preceptor in Singapore who can guide us?
February 11, 2009 10:38:00 AM PST

By the statement of Debashis above, it seems that he has realized that sahaj marg is causing trouble, he understands that any further association with sahaj marg will cause problems but instead of letting off the source of problem, he is unable to leave and get out from the trap of Sahaj Marg, he still hopes that something good can come out from sahaj marg.

What is clearly visible here is, that Debashis has been made completely dependent on transmission, and he is willing to imagine transmission. He is addicted to transmission, and will feel uneasy if he does not get a dose of transmission, and these people call this addiction, SPIRITUALITY!! In reality however, this is what is called "the emotional dependency", once this dependency is achieved, subsequently the victim is manipulated, used and abused, SRCM uses its victims for making money, offers them gateway to God by selling them books costing more than 250 Euro's, SRCM also uses its victim for "free labor", they call it "voluntary service to the mission". This voluntary service is used during functions like celebration of Chari's birthday, threatening those peoples who are against sahaj marg, victims are brainwashed and are also used as construction laborer's for building ashrams for SRCM and also in construction of homes for Chari and his son P. Krishna. Recently during floods in India, humans following philosophy of Sahaj Marg to realize God, were used as free laborer's to reconstruct Sahaj marg's damaged base in south India.

Freedom from Sahaj Marg means freedom from this addiction of transmission, freedom from manipulation, freedom from constant pressure, anxiety, frustration, and fear, it also means absolute independence, and regaining of self respect and sense of honor, which is suppressed for good reasons in sahaj marg.

If a system can produce a person like Parathsarthi Rajagopalachari, we can guess the depth at which sahaj marg degrades humas, the level to which this system can harm and degrade a human, can be understood by understanding the scale at which Parathasarthi Rajagopalachari manipulates people.

Friends, it is possible to bring down this tall tower of lies, it is possible to liberate the members who are trapped in sahaj marg and find it hard to come out and start over again, It is possible for them to become normal and become happy again, leaving wounds of sahaj marg behind as a bad dream, it is true that emotional manipulation and addiction of sahaj marg is hard to wipe out, but it is only that, just hard, but not impossible, each and every one of us, is capable of understanding the simple logic, that God is not slave of criminals.

We all should know that the very concept of God sending messengers to be known and worshiped is absurd. All those who come pretending to bring a message from an invisible god that only they can see are charlatans and their claims are bogus.. The moment we understand this, fall of cults will begin, there cannot be any representative of God, nor anyone can transmit divinity, spirituality is knowledge of God, which is to be learned and discovered by our own unique way, for living in this world, each society has its own rules and we should follow the rules of the society we live in.

Before I advice you on how to leave sahaj marg, you should keep in mind that you will face resistance from those who are still brainwashed and are trapped in Chari’s “mayajaal”, you should be ready to get ostracized, called deaf, dumb and blind, threatened and even begged, cursed and prayed at to come to your senses. But once you are determined to get to the bottom of your predicament, it will become lot easier to overcome the control applied by Chari’s SRCM, and you can live a life of freedom, free from all manipulation and there will not be any need to deny inner voice and feel trapped in illogical and manipulative environment, moment of freedom is not far, all it takes is will power, and inner self reliance, need to listen to logic, and make the jump out from trap of sahaj marg.

To leave Sahaj marg, one should start with apathy; there is no need to announce your discontinuation, develop apathy towards SRCM, and slowly de-associate yourself from all activities followed by SRCM, the important aspect of recovery is not to create a vacuum of faith, one should replace sahaj marg by his/her original religion or ideology!! replacement is better than total rejection of faith, as total rejection of faith will cause a vacuum which you might not have experienced before, and at the time of emotional turmoil, its better to take help of your tried and tested faith instead of falling in trap of any other similar cult.

Mostly members of SRCM are Hindu’s and Christians, if you are a Hindu, start your daily worship and start chanting vedic mantra’s everyday, in short become a normal hindu again, same holds true with those who are Christians, Religions are not bad per-se, there are many people who are religious and lead a happy life, without getting trapped in these illogical fallacies of brighter world and obedience to a manipulator. All this you need to do without announcing your departure from sahaj marg, you need to keep this departure from sahaj marg to yourself... when the drones of SRCM start asking you questions as why you do not attain their weakly brainwashing session, you simply inform them that you have some other work. Do not announce your freedom till you find yourself emotionally independent from SRCM.

Once you feel you are back home from a bumpy drive of SRCM, and you feel strong enough emotionally and have gained enough knowledge about truth of sahaj marg, declare your freedom, and do not keep what you have gained (freedom from Sahaj Marg) to yourself, but make sure you get your family and loved ones out as well, cite yourself as an example and tell them that going against your religion for a fake cult is stupidity, and what you have gained can be gained by each and every member of SRCM.

Point wise summary for "Guide to freedom from sahaj marg" is as follows:-

Step 1 :-

Develop apathy towards Sahaj Marg.

Note:- Do not feel good or bad about sahaj marg, remind yourself that you have got nothing to do with Sahaj marg. This step has to be internal and you should not tell anyone about this, that you are planning to leave sahaj marg, all you need to do is to remind yourself that you have nothing to do with sahaj marg, (This will help you detoxify yourself from all the poisoning they have done to you)

Step 2 :-

De-associate yourself from all activities of SRCM, e.g stop going to brainwashing session of SRCM like sitting with preceptor, and stop attaining what they call satsangs, immediately. Your preceptor will force you for sitting once he discovers that you have started avoiding it, be careful of these preceptors, they are very dangerous, and are instrumental in keeping you trapped inside this cult.

Note:- This step is very important and is very delicate as well, it can take lot of time, depending on your level of brainwashing and the limit to which they have been able to manipulate your thought process, don't give up this fight, and you will be able to cross the threshold needed, and you will stop feeling the need for transmission or dependency on preceptor. just hold on to yourself and do not fall back to manipulation at the stage when you are fighting the war of independence from sahaj marg.

Even if the preceptor is your relative, resist their pressure, you should know that these people are loyal only to their mission, and for them, family, society and love is a form of distraction, they have only one family and only one love which is their master mission and method. Do not get fooled if your preceptor (who happens to be your relative) forces you to stay connected with SRCM. Tell them freedom is your birth right, and s/he cannot force you to follow something which you do not agree. You can tell them that you are thinking about sahaj marg, and have not reached a conclusion.

Step 3 :-

Come back to your original faith. Get back with rituals of your original faith, like if you are a hindu, start visiting temples instead of sahaj marg ranches, visit church if you are a christian, and alike.

Note:- You should try this step along with Step-2, while you are de-associating yourself from activities of sahaj marg, instead of creating a vacuum replace sahaj marg with your own religion and instead of imagining transmission, take refuge in temple or church as the case may be.

Step 4:-

Once you have gained absolute freedom from SRCM, and do not feel any kind of bondage from SRCM announce your freedom and work towards getting your friends and family out from the traps of sahaj marg.

Note:- This step is most important, because by explaining others you will gain a lot of insight, discussion is very important, but make sure you start explaining harms of sahaj marg only after you have gained absolute emotional freedom from sahaj marg, otherwise you may fall in their emotional trap again. So gain emotional freedom from sahaj marg, and then inform everyone that you have left it, and it is possible for everyone to achieve this freedom.

These steps should work, if you can find a way of your own as how to get rid of sahaj marg trap, feel free to share it with the world.

SRCM is based on manipulation and fooling its members, they use spirituality as a tool to make money, and if people become knowledgeable, if people get enlightened, and realize the fact that SRCM by selling messages from brighter world is simply milking them, Sahaj Marg will fall, and it will be erased from history.

The day of freedom from SRCM is not far, with every single person leaving sahaj marg, the very foundation on which sahaj marg is build (manipulation) is shaken, and with every ex-member joining our voice and starting a blog or helping another victim of sahaj marg come out from emotional manipulation and control of SRCM, foundation of sahaj marg will be broken eventually and soon we will find that number of people getting rid of sahaj marg manipulation gains an exponential growth.

We all are with you; all you need to do is to start. Start with questioning; ask for logic behind costly messages from brighter world, answer to your question should be enough to make you start your journey towards "freedom from Sahaj Marg"

Thursday, February 12, 2009

Why bother? Concentrate on your practice.

When a member of sahaj marg encounters our blogs or gets in touch with something which indicates, that what he is doing is wrong, he convinces himself by saying “I should not bother about these issues, it does not matter to me… I will concentrate on my practice” and by thinking this (from heart)… s/he suppresses his own doubts and does not try to find out if the practice he is doing is causing good effect or is actually deteriorating him to below human standards. As a consequence degrade the societal standard.

This is the basic reason for the emotional and mental weakness demonstrated by members of SRCM, these people are not strong enough to accept the truth that they are being fooled in name of spirituality. They follow sahaj marg thinking that they are following a spiritual system, which is far from truth and when someone makes them realize that sahaj marg is not a spiritual system but a business scheme, just like Amway or any other MLM’s, they prefer to ignore this and try to engross themselves more into the fraud of sahaj marg. We all should know that these zombies are not the culprit but the victim, it is not their default behavior but association with sahaj marg has made them so weak that they have lost all power to face the truth, a person who is afraid of truth cannot become a spiritual person, because spirituality is the art of knowing. nothing but the truth, and when a person gets scared of truth and put their head deep in sand and refuse to acknowledge the glaring reality in front of him, how can that person know the infinite???


To get a glimpse of spirituality we need not wonder here and there, all we need to do is to look up…

There are two worlds, the microcosm, and the macrocosm, the internal and the external. We get truth from both of these by means of experience. The truth gathered from internal experience is psychology, metaphysics, and religion; from external experience, the physical sciences. Now a perfect truth should be in harmony with experiences in both these worlds. The microcosm must bear testimony to the macrocosm, and the macrocosm to the microcosm; physical truth must have its counterpart in the internal world, and the internal world must have its verification outside.

External world is visible to everyone, even a child, our universe is waste, and the human race has not been able to find out almost anything about our universe, the cosmos is part of that spirituality which the sages strive for in the past and are doing so now.

We are part of Milky way galaxy, and this galaxy itself is so huge that our sun is like a dust particle as compared to overall size of our galaxy, diameter of our galaxy is 90,000 light years, nearest galaxy is the Sagittarius Dwarf Galaxy which was discovered in 1994, and there are billions of such galaxies with every possibility that life exists at more places in this infinite universe. Our vision of cosmos is limited in time and not space, there are many dimensions of existence other then what we know currently and knowledge of this infinite is what all souls yarn for…

Sahaj Marg defines spirituality as obedience to Mr Parathasarthi Rajagopalachari, who claims himself to be a representative of God. Do they have any idea as what God could be? The galaxy shown above, and billions of such galaxies in our universe are part of that God, Chari and his sahaj marg is limited in brighter world and their spirituality is defined by how obedient a person can become to Mr Parthasarthi Rajagopalachari... God is not human and as such there cannot be any human representative of God, because if there is a human God there has to be a dog God, a cow God, tree God so on and so forth..

That mind which understand this waste universe and the subtle particles which constitute this universe, is called a spiritual person, Hindus have understood the basic constitutional particle of this universe and have named it "Prana", Patanjali formulated a method to control this "prana" by proposing "Pranayam", patanjali's theory, called Raja Yoga, was tested and verified, and then came people like Parthasarthi Rajagopalachair who utilized the established path and gave their business the name of Raja Yoga and begun fooling people.

According to P. Rajagopalachari,

We have to bypass the brain if you are going to be a spiritual person seriously interested in your evolution. Anything that you subject to your brain for evaluation will only doom you to further slavery. I hope you will take this last warning of mine to heart - put away your head completely.

Such kind of statements are very dangerous for our society, thinking is an attribute which is limited to humans, and by not thinking, by not using your brain, you are not becoming spiritual but animal like, if you don't use your mind, you are called idiots, and idiots are not spiritual people, uplifting the cause of society, but are a curse for the society and the society has build mental health clinics for such kind of people, who refuse to use their brains and apply basic logic before committing to any act or thought

Mind is that part of human body which has the potential to let us know God, heart is that part of body, which keeps the body running by pumping blood, it is the mind which gives us the discriminative power and power to apply logic, it is mind which can develop faith, heart can be transplanted, mind cannot be, every mind is unique, humans have won over heart and can successfully change a person's heart, a person can live with heart of an animal, it is medically possible, and has been tested, mind has never been replaced, heart can be replaced.

Every spiritual person known in human history is said to have used his/her brain to maximum possible usage, and this usage has not exceeded 5% of its potential, known to humans.

Just imagine what would have happened if people like kepler, Darwin, Krishna, Vivekanada, Buddha etc used their heart insead of their head? or were part of a concept like sahaj marg??? Humanity would have slumped into hell and there would not have been a single person who would have had the capacity to think freely and with his vision transform the nature of humanity!!! And change the direction in which human race moves.

This is the power of knowledge, and knowledge comes through mind, spirituality is gaining this power through knowledge, and obedience to a tainted person cannot bring about this knowledge of spirituality, but will defiantly slump a person in hell, which is made up of constant fear, hallucination, mental diseases, psychological and emotional turmoil’s. A perturbed life defines sahaj marg today, knowledge, truth of existence, courage, logic, and fearlessness are something which members of sahaj marg are told not to bother about, they are told to be simply obedient and follow whatever dictate comes from SRCM working committee, just imagine plight of Lord Rama, or Lord Krishna, or Lord Buddha, if they had followed the concept of sahaj marg and relied on “messages from brighter world” to erase their “samskara”. This is not spirituality my friends, this is foolishness at its best, stupidity streched to its limit, and it is very dangerous because members of srcm are asked not even to think about their development, they are made absolutely obedient in name of spirituality, members of srcm are controlled and manipulated to the point that they loose all contact with world and get into depression and face numerous psychological and emotional problems, spirituality does not induce hallucination and mental diseases, it heals a person from such diseases, sahaj marg is opposite of spirituality and members Must think about their association with this cult.

Sahaj Marg verses civilized society.

If we compare sahaj marg on a scale of benefit to society and humanity we will find that sahaj marg as a concept is the one which is holding back the growth of humanity, sahaj marg, which claims that to know spirituality one must become obedient to a person who has several criminal cases running in various courts, is the culprit for the downfall of those who are/were associated with this concept at any point of time in their life.
Why bother? Why not concentrate on the practice and follow what preceptor is saying?

Because we are answerable, we are responsible, and we are accountable for our actions.
We are answerable, responsible and accountable for our actions because we are part of society, we were born in this society, we have taken social, emotional and financial security from this society and maintaining the law of the land is responsibility of every human.

Those who renounce society, family and all contacts with infrastructure provided by society can claim that they are not answerable, responsible and accountable for this society, but if we are reaping benefit from our social infrastructure we cannot simply run away and refuse to answer for our deeds, which has caused pain to other fellow humans of our society.

We cannot simply follow what is told to us by those who are facing charges by society, spirituality is bonded with responsibility, and each and every member of this society is answerable for his/her deeds at least.

Association with sahaj marg is a questionable act, and those who are members of srcm need to clarify their stand and answer the society as why they should be given social security when they defy all rules of the society.

Breakdown of social norms:-

There has been many cases of divorce directly associated with practice of sahaj marg.
These poor people have suffered the unspeakable pain and undergone unexplainable suffering only because their partners were brainwashed by this cult of sahaj marg. Who is responsible for these suffering? It is very easy for brainwashed members of srcm to blame the victim of sahaj marg by saying that it must have been their fault for divorce, but this is far from truth, one person cannot be wrong 100% they all have blamed sahaj marg for their divorce, and they have provided verifiable proof’s to substantiate their statements, their partners were brainwashed and manipulated by SRCM and they were in a way separated from their family by SRCM because SRCM provided them with alternate family and relatives who were from their own group.

This isolation of the victim and breakdown of marriages in name of obedience and spirituality is an act of crime against society and Sahaj Marg and Shree Ram Chandra Mission is directly responsible for this horror.

They have to answer this and must pay for their deeds against the social justice and social system because SRCM take benefit from our society and cause harm the same society. We as a responsible part of civilized society seek answer and frame responsibility for sufferings of our fellow humans.

Friday, February 06, 2009

Frustration in SRCM (part-2)

In my previous post i had given the link of SRCM UK balance sheet, which shows that SRCM has spend more money in UK and has made less money in 2008 as compared to 2007. SRCM has approximately 400 members in UK, and has earned GBP 118,330/- whereas in 2007, they were able to make GBP 149,607/- i.e a clear loss of GBP 31,277/-

This loss is not limited in United Kingdom, but SRCM has posted huge loss in almost all countries SRCM is present.

This huge loss explains the reasons for frustration in ranks of SRCM as they are not able to make any money and in order to vent their frustration, they are blaming those who simply oppose the concept of sahaj marg as spiritual method, SRCM is a business house selling sahaj marg, and this is the reason as why they have invented these messages from brighter world which costs over USD 250/- per 600 messages.

Parthasarthi Rajagopalachari claims that the founder of this group Ram Chandra Saxsena aka Babuji, who died in 1983, sends messages to an anonymous french women, these messages are published in form of a book, on a "very good quality" paper, and sold to the members of SRCM.

SRCM has promised that they will publish 3 volumes of these messages last message which will be publish, will be that message, which the anonymous french lady receives (in her dream) on 31st December 2010. This women, (who's identity is kept secret for reasons best known to Parthasarthi Rajagopalachari) gets a message from someone every night in her dream. It is unknown if the french lady knows Hindi or Urdu or English, as Ram Chandra Saxsena spoke only these 3 languages. This secret, underground, hidden and (so called) lady then informs SOMEONE(?), about the dream she had the previous night, her dream (in french) is than translated from french to english, by that SOMEONE, and then it is published.

Last set of 600 messages were sold at $250 or Rs 10,000/- INR, price of new set of messages are not disclosed as yet, but it is said that these messages will be published on a "very good quality" paper, one message in each page, hence it is expected that cost of these messages will be much higher then $250. I will publish the cost of spirituality as soon as i come to know it.

Amazing.... how is it possible that any sane person fall in such a foolish trap and buy anything of this kind which on the very onset of it, establishes itself as a lie...

Much to our surprise, it is possible, and there are people who believe in such kind of things and buy these messages spending hefty sum of money from there pocket, such people are not to be blamed, because they are told, if they give money to SRCM they will become spiritual, here is what Parthasarthi Rajagopalachari is saying while marketing this strange concept of brighter world and associated messages from this strange place:-

One cannot say which message is more important, which is less important, because they are all very important. And I am myself quite amazed when I read the messages of volume two. I have been reading them as they come in to me and they are profound in their implications for our spiritual evolution

This is not enough to sell this awkward concept of brighter world, Parthasarthi Rajagopalachari uses fear, intimidation and also pushes greed in the unsuspecting victim of sahaj marg so that they purchase these costly books. Leader of this cult is fully aware that people have smartness handy nowadays, with internet on their fingertips, the moment anyone develops any doubt, they look for an answer on internet to find out if there is someone else who has experienced a similar situation, Chari knows this fact well and he is also aware of blogs and website on internet which are exposing his lies manipulative tactics, this is the reason as why SRCM working committe members themselves have come out in pulic and are asking people to unjoin communities related to SRCM from orkut, this is asked so that nobody uses orkut or any other web-commuity to find out truth of SRCM, if they do so, they will find our commnuity and read us, and the moment anyone reads us, they will develop doubt, and this doubt will eventually lead to clarity and hence freedom from SRCM. (Chari asks his zombies to become absolutely obedient to him)

He says to become spiritual entire universe must become obeditent to him:-

In spirituality we obey for our own benefit. You obey; you benefit. You don't obey; you don't benefit.

Chari is suggesting here that only those who are obedient to him has benefited in entire human history, the greatest help to human kind has been done by the scientists, how many well known scientist like APJ abdul kalam, Einstein, kepler and likes were obedient to Parthasarthi Rajagopalachari??? just compare contribution of scientist to human race and contribution of members of SRCM to human race, it will become crystel clear as how harmful Sahaj Marg has been to humanity at large.

Chari further say's:-
So you see, spirituality is perhaps - why perhaps - is certainly a curse for those who are here because they don't want to give up the joys of this existence. And they say, "What spirituality? What is the hurry? Let me live while life is there, while I am young, while I have the power to enjoy it.

All these gooblygoody talk of spirituality is only to make money, Chari referrers to spirituality only to sell his costly book, cost of which is suppose to counter the loss he has made in his business.

To make money chari further make mockery of spirituality by saying:-

So these important messages which we have reiterated time and again, in our assemblies, in our satsanghs, they are there, you know, in His beautiful, simple language. All requesting, not ordering. It is strange that we don't want to obey a Master who never orders, because we are too much in the tradition of being ordered around by gods, by gurus, by commanders, by captains, by governments. We are too much used to the twin instruments of religion - fear and temptation - so that we come to Sahaj Marg with suspicion based on centuries of bad experience given to us by our culture, by our tradition, by our religion. Do and get; don't and suffer

Spirituality is not at all dependent on any such messages from these invented sources. Chari is instilling fear in his zombies by saying that those who do not obey him will suffer. And remember all this suffering will come if you do not obey his order and his order is BUY THESE MESSAGES FROM BRIGHTER WORLD costing well over 10,000/- INR or $250/-.

Such tactics of making money is very shameful.

There are criminals in our society, there are people who commit fraud, there are people who are very selfish, but none of these kind of rotten part of our society use this type of cunning method, to fool people and milk them of there money, the method used by Parthasarthi Rajagopalachari.

Parthasarthi Rajagopalachari has a message for those who criticize sahaj marg:-

You know you can read anything and criticize. It is easy to criticize especially if you are a fool, because then you have more to criticize, because you know nothing. So those who criticize without reading, without understanding, without any desire for self-improvement, without any intention of carrying out what is written, they are the greatest critics. "No, no this is all rubbish. No, no this has been said over and over again." Yes, you have been drinking milk everyday. You have been earning money everyday. You have been miserable everyday

Is it possible that a fool can criticize anything? Are criticism free from questioning? is it possible that those who are criticizing sahaj marg are not subjected to logical interpretation? Than why to fear criticism? What is there in criticism which will not help eventually?

Parthasarthi Rajagopalachari fears criticism, because he know that those who are criticizing sahaj marg are speaking the truth and he wants to label critics as fools!!

If critics are fools then why are you afraid of fools?? have a look at what Dr. Adtiya Arya is saying to people in orkut...

Dear Brother,

I thank you on behalf of Master for mentioning S.R.C.M. in your profile. I trust that this is done with a purely good intention. However, lately some miscreants have started misusing such mention of S.R.C.M. on the internet. I would request you to edit your profile immediately and remove any mention of S.R.C.M., S.R.C.M. website or of revered Master and unjoin any SRCM community and also ask anyone you might know to do so immediately.

With love and regards,

Dr. Aditya Arya
Member, Working Committee, Shri Ram Chandra Mission
Jt. Commissioner of Police
Rashtrapati Bhawan
New Delhi 110 001

Why fear criticism? if your system is true and is a "fool"-proof method, why you should be scared of something like orkut?

This fear of criticism is a proof enough that Sahaj Marg cannot stand in front of logic. If spirituality of sahaj marg makes one feel scared of fools, can such a system lead to truth of existence??? This is the question to be asked.

Your time is over Mr. Parthasarthi Rajagopalachari, now your deeds are visible in full public view, truth will come out as who is a fool!! Those who challenge Sahaj Marg or those who are obedient to a madman.

Who is a fool, those who would buy messages from brighter world, or those who say there is no such place called brighter world, its a creation of chari's cunning mind to make money for himself.

Who is a fool, those who accept messages which are said to be coming from a person who died 27 years ago or those who say it is stupidity to spend money for such fallacy and to become spiritual.

Who is a fool, someone who buys books not because he wants to read it, but because if he doesn't buys that book he will not be spiritual because he is not obedient?

For someone who can think, its pretty obvious who is a fool, I need not name such people in this blog, because this blog is dedicated to foolishness of sahaj marg.
Freedom from Sahaj Marg
Our world from another dimension

Be-aware of Sahaj Marg, Personal Testimonial